NewStats: 3,264,934 , 8,185,135 topics. Date: Thursday, 12 June 2025 at 08:47 PM 1z5348

CreativeOrbit:

The Quran acknowledges that salvation is open to righteous Jews, Christians, and Sabians before the message of Islam was completed (Quran 2:62). After that, people are able based on the truth they receive. You might want to study context before quoting verses in isolation.

it seems that the basis for salvation changed according to what you are writing. Are you saying that after the Quran was completed people are judged not more on their righteousness but based on the truth they received? So what if someone is righteous and didn't receive any truth?

5. Your challenge on distortions:
i. What was distorted?
The divinity of Jesus, the Trinity, and salvation by blood sacrifice—none of which Jesus preached.
ii. How?
Through councils, Roman influence, Hellenistic philosophy, and Pauline theology.
iii. When?
Primarily from 70 CE to 400 CE, as doctrines were debated and canonized.
iv. Who?
Early church leaders—especially Paul—who shifted the focus from Jesus' monotheistic message to a Romanized interpretation that conveniently aligned with empire.

you may notice I am ignoring areas I feel you are ignorant concerning the teachings of the new testament especially about what Paul wrote. But my question to you is this do you believe and practice everything Jesus taught in the gospels?

Note, Jesus never taught that he is God, but for the rest of what he taught, concerning love, forgiveness, prayer and the rest do you believe and obey God and what he taught, removing the said distortions and neglecting all Paul wrote. Do you and Muslims believe and practice what Jesus taught?

Jesus wasn't sent to us. He was sent to the children of Israel. We are not Israelites! If Jesus were to descend today we'll follow him as he uses the Shari'ah of Muhammad.

The Injeel has been abrogated by the Qur'an till the world ends! Only the Qur'an exists as the only scripture from Allah!

Jesus said he was not sent but to the lost sheep of Israel!

So how should we obey Jesus?

AntiChristian:
Jesus wasn't sent to us. He was sent to the children of Israel. We are not Israelites! If Jesus were to descend today we'll follow him as he uses the Shari'ah of Muhammad.

The Injeel has been abrogated by the Qur'an till the world ends! Only the Qur'an exists as the only scripture from Allah!

Jesus said he was not sent but to the lost sheep of Israel!

So how should we obey Jesus?

Why calling Jesus and others Muslims when they were not sent to you people in Islam?

RightChanneI:


Why calling Jesus and others Muslims when they were not sent to you people in Islam?

Because the only religion with Allah is Islam.
And all those people submitted to Allah totally becoming Muslims.

AntiChristian:


Because the only religion with Allah is Islam.
And all those people submitted to Allah totally becoming Muslims.

Who is the founder of Islam and who is the first Muslim?

RightChanneI:


Who is the founder of Islam and who is the first Muslim?

Allah is the founder!

Adam is the first man and the first Prophet and the first Muslim!

AntiChristian:


Allah is the founder!

Adam is the first man and the first Prophet and the first Muslim!

I will be going by your ignorance as you know me for. allah was the founder of Islam but he never told Adam the first Muslim as you said to observed the FIVE PILLARS of Islam right?

RightChanneI:


I will be going by your ignorance as you know me for. allah was the founder of Islam but he never told Adam the first Muslim as you said to observed the FIVE PILLARS of Islam right?

Performing 5 pillars of Islam are obligatory upon the nation of Muhammad.

Adam had ways Allah command him to worship him.

A Muslim is one who submits to Allah!

AntiChristian:


Performing 5 pillars of Islam are obligatory upon the nation of Muhammad.

Adam had ways Allah command him to worship him.

A Muslim is one who submits to Allah!

But the five pillars of Islam was not mandatory for Adam whom you called first Muslim despite the fact that your Quran affirmed muhammad as the first Muslim on earth. Perhaps you're trying to tell us the contradictions in Quran!

Adam whom your called the first Muslim never in a day observed any of the five pillars of Islam, so how was he your own first Muslim?

Can you get to jannah of allah filled with houris with different types of bubby without observing five pillars of islam as a Muslim?

RightChanneI:


But the five pillars of Islam was not mandatory for Adam whom you called first Muslim despite the fact that your Quran affirmed muhammad as the first Muslim on earth. Perhaps you're trying to tell us the contradictions in Quran!

Adam whom your called the first Muslim never in a day observed any of the five pillars of Islam, so how was he your own first Muslim?

Can you get to jannah of allah filled with houris with different types of bubby without observing five pillars of islam as a Muslim?

This is false. Adam had the ways he observed his own Salah. He did have his own fast. And he did have Tawheed as no one worshipped idols till the time of Noah!

Allah didn't reveal five pillars to Adam but Muhammad salallahu alayhi wasalam.

For example, If a lecturer gives a course and sells a book for the course. Then after some years another lecturer revised the book, let's say the fifth edition but with major changes.

Then you'll say since the book and the course outline did change then the course too have changed entirely.

AntiChristian:


This is false. Adam had the ways he observed his own Salah. He did have his own fast. And he did have Tawheed as no one worshipped idols till the time of Noah!

What is false? How does Adam observe his own salah and how does he observe his own hajj one of the five pillars of Islam for calling him a Muslim?

AntiChristian:

Allah didn't reveal five pillars to Adam but Muhammad salallahu alayhi wasalam.

😂😂 so allah the founder of Islam as you claimed forgot to revealed the five pillars of Islam to Adam the first Muslim as you said right?

AntiChristian:

For example, If a lecturer gives a course and sells a book for the course. Then after some years another lecturer revised the book, let's say the fifth edition but with major changes.

Then you'll say since the book and the course outline did change then the course too have changed entirely.

Is allah a lecturer, is allah of yesterday different from today, your allah didn't revealed any book to Adam on how to worship him yet according to you, Adam was the first Muslim despite the fact that Quran affirmed muhammad as the first Muslim on earth. It seems you know Islam more than the author of Quran!

RightChanneI:


Why calling Jesus and others Muslims when they were not sent to you people in Islam?

that's another point, why are they trying to associate themselves with Moses and Jesus who wasn't sent to them, is there a need other than seeking to show authenticity by associating with the ones who are authentic.

One who would want to remove doubt from themselves will associate themselves with those who are trusted. And then declare themselves unquestionable is highly suspicious.

AntiChristian:
Jesus wasn't sent to us. He was sent to the children of Israel. We are not Israelites! If Jesus were to descend today we'll follow him as he uses the Shari'ah of Muhammad.

The Injeel has been abrogated by the Qur'an till the world ends! Only the Qur'an exists as the only scripture from Allah!

Jesus said he was not sent but to the lost sheep of Israel!

So how should we obey Jesus?

this is you claiming you seldomly respond but here you are responding to a question you were not directly asked.

And again you are not tracking the conversation. Instead you are trying to justify your own reasoning.

Jesus came from God and preached the message of God or are you going to tell us the specific message sent to the Israel was only what he taught, then tell us what is it. You are not tracking because orbit mentioned what is corrupted in the igneel and the question still stands do you obey the rest that you don't find corrupted. But you are saying no because Jesus wasn't sent to you.

It's like saying you don't obey, thou shall not murder because God spoke to the people of Israel.

AntiChristian:


Because the only religion with Allah is Islam.
And all those people submitted to Allah totally becoming Muslims.

The issue becomes when any of you claim that Allah is the God of Israel. Are you saying that Israel were Muslims? Yes or no

RightChanneI:


What is false? How does Adam observe his own salah and how does he observe his own hajj one of the five pillars of Islam for calling him a Muslim?




😂😂 so allah the founder of Islam as you claimed forgot to revealed the five pillars of Islam to Adam the first Muslim as you said right?




Is allah a lecturer, is allah of yesterday different from today, your allah didn't revealed any book to Adam on how to worship him yet according to you, Adam was the first Muslim despite the fact that Quran affirmed muhammad as the first Muslim on earth. It seems you know Islam more than the author of Quran!

😂😂.
any Muslim can please come and answer how is Allah the founder and Adam the first muslim. How the he find it and how did Adam follow it, come and explain

gohf:


The issue becomes when any of you claim that Allah is the God of Israel. Are you saying that Israel were Muslims? Yes or no

Yes, they and anyone who believes in Allah, worships Him and submit to Him alone are Muslims.

Race does not matter!

gohf:
this is you claiming you seldomly respond but here you are responding to a question you were not directly asked.

And again you are not tracking the conversation. Instead you are trying to justify your own reasoning.

Jesus came from God and preached the message of God or are you going to tell us the specific message sent to the Israel was only what he taught, then tell us what is it. You are not tracking because orbit mentioned what is corrupted in the igneel and the question still stands do you obey the rest that you don't find corrupted. But you are saying no because Jesus wasn't sent to you.

It's like saying you don't obey, thou shall not murder because God spoke to the people of Israel.

The question should not arise at all since Jesus has the demography he was sent to! He said he has his sheep given to him by his father in John 10:26-29. Since he wasn't sent to us then we have no business obeying him.

And the message of Jesus has been abrogated by the Qu'ran just as Jesus's message abrogates the Torah!

AntiChristian:


!

You haven't finish what you started here!

RightChanneI:


What is false? How does Adam observe his own salah and how does he observe his own hajj one of the five pillars of Islam for calling him a Muslim?




😂😂 so allah the founder of Islam as you claimed forgot to revealed the five pillars of Islam to Adam the first Muslim as you said right?




Is allah a lecturer, is allah of yesterday different from today, your allah didn't revealed any book to Adam on how to worship him yet according to you, Adam was the first Muslim despite the fact that Quran affirmed muhammad as the first Muslim on earth. It seems you know Islam more than the author of Quran!

gohf:
😂😂.
any Muslim can please come and answer how is Allah the founder and Adam the first muslim. How the he find it and how did Adam follow it, come and explain

AntiChristian will you call for help?

RightChanneI:


You haven't finish what you started here!

I didn't start anything!

I don talk my own!

RightChanneI:


AntiChristian will you call for help?

Call who for help?

Allah created us and made Islam the religion for us.

“This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâm as your religion” [al-Maa’idah 5:3]

“And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers” [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85].

After the coming of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), Islam means what he brought, not any other religion.

AntiChristian:


Yes, they and anyone who believes in Allah, worships Him and submit to Him alone are Muslims.

Race does not matter!

okay so if the Israelites were Muslims according to you and Jesus was sent to the Muslims, why are you saying Jesus was not sent to you?

AntiChristian:


The question should not arise at all since Jesus has the demography he was sent to! He said he has his sheep given to him by his father in John 10:26-29. Since he wasn't sent to us then we have no business obeying him.

And the message of Jesus has been abrogated by the Qu'ran just as Jesus's message abrogates the Torah!

by his father, you mean the God, right? the one you call Allah who sent Jesus?

Okay you are quoting from the igneel the part you believe isn't corrupted right, let's look at it and see if you are correct that you have no business obeying Him, even if I do not disagree with you saying you are not one of his sheep anyway.

John 10
John.10.24 - The Jewish leaders surrounded him and asked, "How long are you going to keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly."
John.10.25 - Jesus replied, "I have already told you, and you don't believe me. The proof is what I do in the name of my Father.
John.10.26 - But you don't believe me because you are not part of my flock.

Now you as a Muslim claim to believe in Jesus and say everyone who serves God is a Muslim. From this incorruptible statement by Jesus that those who do not believe Jesus as the Messiah are not part of his flock.. therefore we can also say that those who believe are part of his flock.

1. If you say you believe in Jesus and you are not part of his flock, then what are you?

What was the purpose of Jesus going to the flock, let's read
John.10.27 - My sheep recognize my voice; I know them, and they follow me.
John.10.28 - I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them away from me.

2. If you believe Jesus is the Messiah do you follow and obey him?

3. Do you believe that Jesus came to give you eternal life, by God's authority?

This are simple questions from the part of the igneel that's not corrupted according to one of you.


Okay. Hmm

You are not using the word abrogate properly because Jesus did not do away with the Torah but fulfilled the promises contained in them, which was the very purpose of he Torah which also contained temporal laws and priesthood which is what was abrogated by God. So the message doesn't abrogate the Torah, it is good news speaking concerning the fulfillment contained in the Torah. So to say that the message of Jesus was done away with by the Quran you would have to explain to us, how and why that is?

If you are basing that the Quran did to the gospel what it did to the Torah, because you see it that the gospel is against the Torah and destroys it, so also the Quran does so. Or you agree and understand that to be incorrect and that the gospel is a fulfillment, so show us how the Quran fulfills and abrogates the gospel(which is the message of Jesus)?

Any Muslim can try and attempt these questions please.

😛

Let’s deal with your latest display of intellectual hopscotch and shifting goalposts.

First of all, CreativeOrbit and AntiChristian have already addressed your previous points — multiple times — with clarity, but you conveniently ignore what doesn't serve your bias, only to repackage it in slightly different words as if you’re saying something new. That’s not curiosity. That’s willful blindness and rhetorical evasion.

1. “Did the basis for salvation change?”

No — the standard for salvation in Islam has always been the same: Submission to the will of God, through the revelation He provided at the time. You’re trying to create a contradiction that doesn’t exist.

In pre-Islamic times, people were judged based on the truth they received — whether it was the Torah, the Gospel (before distortion), or innate monotheism (fitrah). After the Qur’an was revealed and completed, it became the final and preserved standard. That’s not a shift — that’s progressive revelation, a concept even the Bible acknowledges, unless you plan to argue that Moses and Jesus brought identical legal and spiritual teachings.

And to your next hypothetical:

> “What if someone is righteous and didn’t receive any truth?”

Islam already addressed that. The Prophet Muhammad explicitly said that people who never received the message will be tested by God in a fair way on the Day of Judgment. No one is condemned for ignorance — but no one gets a free for rejecting truth once it's clearly delivered either. So spare us the fake moral dilemma.

2. “You may notice I’m ignoring areas you are ignorant about…”

How noble of you to it to cherry-picking what you want to address. You accuse others of ignorance, but won't engage their actual arguments or citations. That’s not a theological stance — that’s intellectual cowardice.

If you truly think Paul’s letters define Christian truth, you’ve already abandoned what Jesus taught. Paul made contradictions to Jesus on salvation (e.g., faith vs. law), the nature of God, and even ethics. So it’s ironic you now ask:

> “Do Muslims believe and practice what Jesus taught?”

Let’s flip that on you:
Do YOU? Or have you buried Jesus' teachings under a pile of Pauline reinterpretations, Church councils, and creeds Jesus never uttered?

3. “Do Muslims follow Jesus' teachings?”

Yes — more than modern Christians do.

Jesus taught monotheism? So do Muslims.

Jesus prayed to God with his face to the ground? Muslims still do.

Jesus fasted? Muslims fast an entire month.

Jesus forbade worshiping him as God? Muslims obey that too.

Jesus called people to obedience, charity, humility, and prayer? These are pillars in Islam.

In contrast, your theology promotes worship of Jesus, dismisses the law, and relies on Paul's words more than Christ's actual sayings.

So no — you don’t get to ask, “Do you follow Jesus?” when your entire faith structure stands on rejecting what Jesus lived and taught.

Summary:

Don’t pretend to be the gatekeeper of truth when your own position is riddled with inconsistency. If you want to talk theology, bring arguments, not arrogance — and at least do the courtesy of acknowledging when your questions have already been answered.

Until then, stop running in circles and acting like no one sees it.

TenQ gohf AntiChristian CreativeOrbit

AntiChristian:


Call who for help?

Allah created us and made Islam the religion for us.

“This day, I have perfected your religion for you, completed My Favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islâm as your religion” [al-Maa’idah 5:3]

“And whoever seeks a religion other than Islâm, it will never be accepted of him, and in the Hereafter he will be one of the losers” [Aal ‘Imraan 3:85].

After the coming of Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him), Islam means what he brought, not any other religion.

Then answer the question don't just look away!


With Quran reference, how does Adam observe salah and how does he perform his own hajj one of the five pillars of Islam for calling him a Muslim?

RightChanneI:


Then answer the question don't just look away!


With Quran reference, how does Adam observe salah and how does he perform his own hajj one of the five pillars of Islam for calling him a Muslim?

It has been answered. Adam alayhi salaam had his way of worshipping Allah which was revealed to him. Just as Muhammad salallahu alayhi wasalam had his. They only need to submit to Allah as He wills.

gohf:
okay so if the Israelites were Muslims according to you and Jesus was sent to the Muslims, why are you saying Jesus was not sent to you?

Asking the same question in another way does not change it.

You'll still refuse to accept the truth!

Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Israel. Are we from Israel?

And Jesus's dispensation had lapsed!

gohf:
by his father, you mean the God, right? the one you call Allah who sent Jesus?

The biblical Jesus call his God father. "My father and your father, my God and your God". I think you know that verse too. That's your biblical exaggerations not Islam's. God, Allah has no son in Jesus or other humans.

Okay you are quoting from the igneel the part you believe isn't corrupted right, let's look at it and see if you are correct that you have no business obeying Him, even if I do not disagree with you saying you are not one of his sheep anyway.

I am quoting the translated copy of the copy of the copy of the copy of the copy of the copy........of the Injeel at best! The original copies of the Bible as written by the first authors are all extinct! I am not an Israelite. Even Jesus discriminated against a Canaanite woman due to her race!

John.10.24 - The Jewish leaders surrounded him and asked, "How long are you going to keep us in suspense? If you are the Messiah, tell us plainly."
John.10.25 - Jesus replied, "I have already told you, and you don't believe me. The proof is what I do in the name of my Father.
John.10.26 - But you don't believe me because you are not part of my flock.

But why not quote verse 29 where Jesus says "My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all" This still means it was his father that gave those sheep to him. The lost sheep of Israel. A specific demography!

Now you as a Muslim claim to believe in Jesus and say everyone who serves God is a Muslim. From this incorruptible statement by Jesus that those who do not believe Jesus as the Messiah are not part of his flock.. therefore we can also say that those who believe are part of his flock.

Matthew 15:24 - Then Jesus said to the woman, “I was sent only to help God’s lost sheep—the people of Israel.”
I no be Israelite! Jesus was not even sent to all Israel. But the lost ones!

1. If you say you believe in Jesus and you are not part of his flock, then what are you?

I believe in Jesus as God sent to the people of Israel just like I did others before him. Moses wasn't sent to me. Noah wasn't sent to me.. Jonah wasn't sent to me! Joseph wasn't sent to me. John the Baptist wasn't sent to me! Jesus wasn't sent to me! Only Muhammad salallahu alayhi wasalam is sent to all of us. Everyone of them had the respective people they were sent to!

What was the purpose of Jesus going to the flock, let's read
John.10.27 - My sheep recognize my voice; I know them, and they follow me.
John.10.28 - I give them eternal life, and they will never perish. No one will snatch them away from me.

Is the Canaanite woman in Matthew 15:24 among his sheep? If so then Jesus lied by saying “I was sent only to help God’s lost sheep—the people of Israel.”

If Canaan is not Israel how can Nigeria or Africa be Israel?

2. If you believe Jesus is the Messiah do you follow and obey him?

Do I have to obey Moses, Noah and others too? No!

The Messiah is to guide the lost sheep of Israel to salvation and not Africans.

3. Do you believe that Jesus came to give you eternal life, by God's authority?

He didn't even preach to the Canaanite woman at all. Did he came to save her or guide her to eternity?

This are simple questions from the part of the igneel that's not corrupted according to one of you.

How do you know which part is corrupted or not? Our judge is our Qur'an! Whatever the Qur'an affirms is true!

No trinity! Jesus is fully human! He did miracles by Allah's leave. He didn't die but was raised up body and soul.

Okay. Hmm

You are not using the word abrogate properly because Jesus did not do away with the Torah but fulfilled the promises contained in them, which was the very purpose of he Torah which also contained temporal laws and priesthood which is what was abrogated by God. So the message doesn't abrogate the Torah, it is good news speaking concerning the fulfillment contained in the Torah. So to say that the message of Jesus was done away with by the Quran you would have to explain to us, how and why that is?

That's your own opinion or maybe the Christian opinion. The Torah was a law for the people of Moses and some other Prophets after him.

When Jesus came some laws in the Torah were abrogated and some relaxed! This is a major change! This is why Christians today separates the old testament and new testament. Why do you still fight about tithing till today? How many old testament laws do you still observe apart from the major ten commandments?

Can you stone your stubborn or rebellion child as stated in the old testament?

The way the Bible was written makes it look like a separate God exists in the old testament and in the New testament. One is fierce and brutal while the other is cool, calm and forgiving!

If you are basing that the Quran did to the gospel what it did to the Torah, because you see it that the gospel is against the Torah and destroys it, so also the Quran does so. Or you agree and understand that to be incorrect and that the gospel is a fulfillment, so show us how the Quran fulfills and abrogates the gospel(which is the message of Jesus)?

Any Muslim can try and attempt these questions please.

The gospel as well as the Torah were never preserved as scripture! Human hands has crept into them both. That's why their originals in the language Jesus spoke never existed.

How can Jesus be speaking Aramaic and the Book exists as Greek? Was Jesus a Greek?

Scriptures are meant to replace and confirm one another! The Injeel did mention and confirmed the Torah. The Qur'an too did mention and confirmed all previous scriptures before it.

No scripture is against any other scripture! The Injeel in its true form will not be against the Qur'an. Same as the Torah!

But these do not exist anymore!

Only the Qur'an survived!

AntiChristian:
The biblical Jesus call his God father. "My father and your father, my God and your God". I think you know that verse too. That's your biblical exaggerations not Islam's. God, Allah has no son in Jesus or other humans.

are you saying that the Jesus of the Quran and the Jesus of the Bible are two different persons?

AntiChristian:


Asking the same question in another way does not change it.

You'll still refuse to accept the truth!

Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of Israel. Are we from Israel?

And Jesus's dispensation had lapsed!

it's a question based on what you have said. Did you not say all who follow Allah are Muslims. Did you not say that israelites are Muslims.

Okay why not explain to us how it is true that Jesus who was sent to Muslims was not sent to you?

Are you saying because Jesus is not on earth his message to the Muslims is no more?

You asking are you from Israel when you said following Allah is not a racial thing, is confusing, either you redefine your interpretation of those who follow Allah and explain or you answer the question and explain.

Is not about refusing the truth but refusing lies.

Answer this as well, was Jesus sent to Muslims? Yes or no

Just know
If you say yes, then you are a Muslim
If you say no, and say to Israel then that means Israel were never Muslims and are different from muslims. Or explain in clear what you mean.

2. “Do you honor Muhammad more than Jesus?”

We honor both, but we worship neither — that’s the difference between Islam and Christianity.

a university graduate who faced exams would realize that you failed this question. The question isn't if you honor them or not, but if you honor one more than the other. Jimrohn, do you realize how you have failed here. No one is asking you about Christianity, but you can't answer an Islamic question without referencing another religion. Is the basis of Islam Christianity? You would say no, but it shows you can't address a question without making such references even while not even understanding the question in the first place.

Jesus is one of the five greatest prophets in Islam. But Muhammad ﷺ is the final messenger — the one through whom the last and complete revelation was delivered. That doesn’t reduce the honor of Jesus — it clarifies the hierarchy of prophethood based on their roles. If you think honor equals divinity, that’s a problem with your theology, not ours.

now if it's a revelation to complete what God has been revealing, surely you should know the revelations from the beginning as well as the gospel and the final revelation, can you claim to be ignorant of other parts and still claim to have the whole because you have the final piece.

Now you look at yourself saying it clarifies the hierarchy of prophethood, which means one is greater than the other if you indeed were genuinely saying that it wasn't to reduce the honor of Jesus it's either you are stating he never had such honor or that hierarchy is just a mere number to how they came and not how they should be evaluated and honored. So your simple answer should have been yes we honor Muhammad above Jesus then followed by this explanation as to why that this. Franky it's your own problem if you assume someone's else makes a fallacy of claiming honor equals divinity. You are addressing someone without respectfully first enquiring of their theological believes. You can't answer questions properly because you are treating it like warfare which is sad and appalling.

3. “Adam was forgiven but cast out — so what was the point of forgiveness?”

Your confusion comes from treating God's forgiveness like a “reset button.” Being forgiven doesn’t erase all consequences — it removes the spiritual penalty, not the worldly effect.

Adam was forgiven — yes — but paradise was never meant to be his eternal home at that point. Earth was always the plan. His fall was not “original sin,” it was a mistake followed by repentance and elevation. Islam rejects the idea that all of mankind is born sinful because of Adam’s mistake — a toxic doctrine that paints God as unjust and man as inherently damned.

okay so if Adam's sin was not the first and original sin, who or what was the first sin based on Islam and the Quran?

I understand what you have written that Islam rejects the idea that all mankind is born sinful, but can you tell us why sins and falls into temptations if according to you man lacks a sinful nature?

Okay, you said elevation, so tell us elevation in what sense?

And another question which you can ignore since it wasn't you who said it, but apparently the Quran or Islam says Allah will throw all into hell, that should include Adam whom he has forgiven right?

4. “Aisha’s age: 9 or older?”

Aisha's age is used obsessively by Islamophobes who don’t care about context, history, or scholarship. Yes, some hadith report she was 9 at consummation — and these are found in Sahih Bukhari and Muslim, considered strong sources. However, classical and modern scholars have pointed to other evidence (like her involvement in battles, historical gaps, or statements by her relatives) that suggest a higher age.

But let’s get brutally honest: None of this was controversial until Western morality began to falsely universalize modern standards. In her society, this was normal, dignified, and unchallenged. You don’t get to retroactively impose your lens on 7th century Arabia while ignoring far worse age gaps in Christian Europe’s royal marriages.

And unless you’re ready to apply that same outrage to Solomon, David, or even Mary’s “engagement” to Joseph in your own religious texts, maybe sit this one out.

telling me to sit it out is pathetic. I personally do not care how old she was. Our Nigerian great grandfather's may have done same, but you had to pathetically do the same thing hypothetices do to Aisha to Mary as well just o justify what exactly. A level headed person would choose to understand how she could have been way older than some claim, it's funny that the Bible doesn't even mention the ages of women or wives but no way you calculate it and claim Mary was preteen.

5. “Did Jesus fail his assignment?”

This is pure ignorance — and no, Muslims do not believe Jesus failed. We believe his mission was interrupted, not failed. His return is part of completing that mission — not bringing new revelation, but affirming Islam, breaking the cross, and killing the false messiah (Dajjal).

Anyone who says “Jesus failed” is either misrepresenting Islam, or parroting half-baked statements. The failure lies in what people did with his message, not the message itself.

speak for yourself as you claimed some of you are purely ignorant, which I agree. Now based on your own view of his mission being interrupted clear to clarify how you came about that understanding? Is it because he left and is coming back?
So can we say that he succeeded his mission before he left, and you could also tell us what his mission from God was?

6. “Why did God create man according to the Qur’an?”

This one’s easy. Qur’an 51:56 —

> “And I did not create jinn and mankind except to worship Me.”

We were created for submission, worship, and moral responsibility — not to “fall” and then beg for salvation based on inherited sin. We’re here to prove ourselves, to be tested, and to return to our Creator.

You want a purpose? That’s it: Know God, submit to Him, live morally, die with faith.

lol you could have simply answered to worship God. But seeing how enthusiastic you are, why not tell us how God revealed that purpose to the first man, through Jesus and through Muhammad and tell us what does worship God mean, what does it mean to worship God.

7. “Why did God send Jesus?”

Because God sent prophets to every nation (Qur’an 16:36). Jesus was sent to the Children of Israel, as a reformer and a prophet, confirming the Torah and bringing the Injil. That’s Qur’an 3:49 and 61:6.

He was never sent to be crucified for sins he didn’t commit. He wasn’t sent to change God's law or start a new religion. He came to call his people to repentance and monotheism. Period.

Closing Note:

You claim to be asking out of ignorance, but the way your questions are framed shows loaded assumptions, subtle insults, and cherry-picked controversies. If you're sincere, fix your tone, read a Qur’an for once, and stop relying on internet polemics.

If you want truth, seek it. If you want to argue, be ready for the weight of a 1400-year-old religion with answers sharper than your questions.
CreativeOrbit AntiChristian TenQ gohf

You could have focused on the Quran and even quote the verses you mentioned. Anyway
Quran 16:36
For We assuredly sent amongst every People a messenger, (with the Command), “Serve Allah, and eschew Evil”: of the People were some whom Allah guided, and some on whom error became inevitably (established). So travel through the earth, and see what was the end of those who denied (the Truth).

So this verse is saying a messenger, are you saying this messenger is Jesus based on the context of your answer? Yes or no?
If you say no, then does it mean messengers are sent from every nation, how does this line up with the final messenger when well there are new nations and no more messengers?

Quran 3:49
And [make him] a messenger to the Children of Israel, [who will say], 'Indeed I have come to you with a sign from your Lord in that I design for you from clay [that which is] like the form of a bird, then I breathe into it and it becomes a bird by permission of Allah . And I cure the blind and the leper, and I give life to the dead - by permission of Allah . And I inform you of what you eat and what you store in your houses. Indeed in that is a sign for you, if you are believers.

Now this verse doesn't state that he is only a messenger to the children of Israel.

Can we say that Muhammad was only a messenger to the middle east and people he spoke to?


Pardon me to add verse 50
And [I have come] confirming what was before me of the Torah and to make lawful for you some of what was forbidden to you. And I have come to you with a sign from your Lord, so fear Allah and obey me.

Here isa, Jesus, clearly obey me. The question now is, the Muslims the disciples obeyed him, do you Muslims obey Jesus?

I don't see where it is written that you should disobey Jesus or that he is sent only to Israel or that because he is sent to Israel you should disobey him.

Quite frankly, if Allah could teach Jesus the Torah, there is no excuse for Muhammad not knowing the Torah and the gospel which are supposedly before the Quran.

Okay, the next verse you quoted Quran 61:6
And call to mind when Jesus, son of Mary, said: “O Children of Israel, I am Allah’s Messenger to you, I the Torah which has come before me, and I give you the glad tiding of a Messenger who shall come after me, his name being Ahmad.” Yet when he came to them with Clear Signs they said: “This is sheer trickery.”

This is amazing. Jesus says I give you the gospel of a messenger to come, his name is Ahmad.

Now if I am to assume the Ahmad is Muhammad and that Jesus is either calling him the gospel that is to come or that he is given them the glad tidings that Muhammad would also bring.

It still begs to be answer, the question what is the gospel preached and taught by Muhammad, what is the good news from the Quran?